Comments on: a comment that got too long

By: revabi

revabi — Mon, 03 Sep 2007 04:24:47 +0000

I have read and heard Paul Borden. He is very interesting, and very directive, but these times call for hard things to be said. I like our answers. I think we are all struggling with these issues.

By: jledmiston

jledmiston — Fri, 31 Aug 2007 03:03:30 +0000

Great food for thought. Thanks, RM - and all.

By: anne

anne — Thu, 30 Aug 2007 16:18:38 +0000

on the ushering thing, i think it’s a “calling” issue and those who have the gift of hospitality are those who should always have the opportunity to usher, greet, etc. if there are others who might like to usher and greet or be needed to usher and greet, pair them w/ a person who is called to this ministry. hospitality is best caught, not taught.

By: Serena

Serena — Thu, 30 Aug 2007 15:26:32 +0000

Thanks for this great response to Jan’s thought-provoking question. I especially like the “pothole” example. I will be sharing this here where I serve.

By: Kelley

Kelley — Thu, 30 Aug 2007 15:11:31 +0000

Exactly. We cannot force change but only provide a safe place to be loved and experience relationship. One reason I am so excited about the upcoming all church retreat is because you and your ministry team have created an all inclusive, please-come-be-part-of-a-family feel for the retreat. I sincerely anticipate that members of our church will grow closer to each other and to God because we will spend REAL time together laughing, resting, hiking, etc. And I sincerely hope that this experience will change each of us just enough (or more) to be kinder to a stranger, be more patient in big city traffic, forgive another who angers us, love more unconditionally, etc.

The question that kept running through my mind last night after reading your post was “Is the church, our beloved church, (ie the whole church not just suburban church) RELEVANT to the “outside” watching world? Are we living transformative love in our church?

This post has really got me thinking. My comments are definitely getting too long! Thanks for the thoughts.

By: reverendmother

reverendmother — Thu, 30 Aug 2007 10:59:50 +0000

No Kelley, that is a very good point. And really, all we can do as church leaders is try to create a space where people can have that relational experience. But we cannot force it, and all the training in the world won’t get someone to a place where they just aren’t.

By: Kelley

Kelley — Thu, 30 Aug 2007 04:20:34 +0000

-So for example, ushers need to get from “We hand out the bulletins”
to “We reflect the welcome and hospitality of Christ toward friend and
stranger alike.” It is a training issue-

RM, it is a training issue indeed, but I really, really think it is mostly an experience issue. We move from our traditional understanding of church and ministry to a missional understanding of ministry when we ourselves are transformed through real-life, relational experiences (love, forgiveness, anger, apathy, suffering, hope). And that transformation is an ongoing process which happens through the “traditional roles” of ministry (leaders, liturgists, ushers, etc.) and more importanly in relationship with each other and God together.

We cannot be transformed without being in a community. Ministry and all its programs, among other things, provides a community for people to flesh out their humanity and dare to move from “handing out bulletins” to being Christ incarnate through the hospitality of welcoming someone in worship”.

And then when we are able to see God’s face in each other in the church, then we are able to see God’s face in stranger and friend alike beyond the church. And that is transformation.

Yet even as I write this I find I cannot find the right words to say what I am thinking and I wonder if I have ever even understood what it means to be a missional church.

By: Diane

Diane — Thu, 30 Aug 2007 02:31:26 +0000

I think that one of the problems is that at the heart of it all, worship is probably the most important thing we do. It is the unique thing that the Christian church has to offer. But most people think of worship as “for us” (you know, meeting our needs) rather than either for God, or, for the sake of the world (not simply “worship evangelism”, but worship that is a sign to the world of the Kingdom….and that flows out to service & discipleship to the world

Now THIS comment is getting too long…

But you are getting me started thinking…

By: Jill

Jill — Thu, 30 Aug 2007 02:23:49 +0000

I agree language is powerful. Before I came on staff, the church changed all “committees” to “work areas,” thinking committees meet, while work areas get things accomplished. I can’t say it had a positive impact. I would have preferred “ministry,” or perhaps “mission area.”

Thanks for the pothole story, btw.